December 2002-January 2003
I didn't have a whole lot to say, but I just wanted to thank all of those who built and worked on this website. There have been many pictures on here that I have never seen of her and it was wonderful to see what her children look like. It's wonderful that people put in the effort to continue her legacy on. Thank you very much.Heather Williams
Spokane, Washington, USA
Tuesday, January 28, 2003
I'm writing an essay on the parallels between Plath's life and her character Esther Greenwood in he novel "The Bell Jar." I already have tons of information on how Plath and Esther are similar, but I can't seem to find much that relates the other characters in the novel to Plath's life.(other than: father, mother and Dick Norton as Buddy.)
This was not an assignment I had to do on the "Bell Jar." I chose it because last year I had picked up the novel, not even knowing who Plath was, read the back and luckily descided to read the book. I really enjoyed te book and later got the Colossus and read many other poems online. SO when the opportunity arose to learn more about Plath and get a grade for it, I felt more like I was getting a present then doing work.
However its been hard getting information since the internet never gets to in depth and Black Magic was already checked out at my library. Any help you can give me is appreciated.
Loren
USA
Sunday, January 26, 2003
Hi, I'm currently studying Sylvia Plath at school but I'm afraid I'm not quite as knowledgable on the subject as you people are so I would be grateful for your assistance. I need help interpreting th poem "Poppies in July".I know that around the time this poem was written, Hughes was involved with another woman -Assia Wevill I believe her name was,a Canadien friend of the couple's. Anyway, am I correct in thinking that this poem is written about Assia, and it is her that the poppies refer to? When Plath says "I cannot stop you" does this mean that she sees the ongoing affair with Hughes but is powerless to stop it?And she is exhausted with jealousy watching Assia who is so vibrant and interesting- "red"- in contrast to Plath who considers herself "colourless".I don't understand the " a mouth just bloodied" line or "bloody skirts". The lines may have something to do with war? Could it be the bloodthirsty streak in Plath coming out? I would be greatly obliged if someone would explain this poem to me. Thank you,Charla Madigan
Dublin, Ireland
Wednesday, January 22, 2003
I found this interesting reference on Salon.com today:
"[Arthur] Miller's researches into the Salem witch trials of 1692 were conducted while he and many of his colleagues were under investigation by the House Un-American Activities Committee....Despite the indifferent reviews and dwindling audiences, the production [The Crucible]struggled on for some months as "an act of resistance" by many of the actors, many of whom soon worked for little or no pay. Miller recalls one memorable performance when, just at John Proctor's execution, the audience stood up and bowed their heads for several minutes; the puzzled cast were finally informed that the Rosenbergs were at that moment being electrocuted in Sing Sing."
Kim
Detroit, USA
Wednesday, January 22, 2003
Apparently, Jaqueline Rose has a new book out called On Not Being Able to Sleep: Psychoanalysis and the Modern World which contains an essay about Plath and the disagreement she had with Hughes over her interpretation of the "The Rabbit Catcher". There is a review for this on Guardian and I'm including the link hereStephanie
Ottawa, Canada
Tuesday, January 21, 2003
I am trying to find the name of a Sylvia Plath poem that I read many years ago that talked about a girl trying to kill herself with woodgrain alcohol and involved a discussion with a servant. Any help would be greatly appreciated. ThanksJerilynn
Austin, USA
Tuesday, January 21, 2003
Its interesting you should say that about finding copies of "Wintering" earlier then its expected release date, Peter. I checked Amazon.ca and the estimated delivery time has changed from 4-6 weeks to 12-14 days and instead of saying February 11, 2003 it now just says February 2003, so obviously its arriving in stores earlier then previously thought. I also noticed that the "sales rank" has substantially gone up as well and is now sitting at 44,415.Stephanie
Ottawa, Canada
Tuesday, January 21, 2003
Here's an interview with Kate Moses!Amanda
Bradenton, FL, USA
Monday, January 20, 2003
You have an amazing website here. I would like to give a lot of thanks to you for taking the time to put together such an awesome website for Sylvia Plath fans such as myself, to look up information about her life and even view pictures of her throughout her lifetime. I just finished reading The Bell Jar today and the usage of Plath's words are amazingly haunting. . . Again, on behalf of each and everyone one of us Sylvia Plath fans out there. . . Thank you! Your time in putting this website together is much appreciated!Razan
North Little Rock, USA
Monday, January 20, 2003
Just a heads up that "Wintering" should be available at most bookstores (at least in Boston) this week. I found two copies at the Harvard Coop this afternoon. The Harvard Book Store hadn't received anything yet. I can't be bothered to go to Borders or B & N so I don't know when they'll have it!Peter K Steinberg
Boston, USA
Monday, January 20, 2003
I am currently writing my coursework essay for A level English Literature and have chose the title of "With which central charcter in "The Catcher in the Rye" and "The Bell Jar" do you feel most sympathy and why?". For this I am exploring the "you" part of the question and researching other people's opinions and interpretations of Holden Caulfield and Esther Greenwood. I would greatly appreciate anyone's input on this topic; who do you indentify with as a charcter? Who do you feel mostsympathy with? As i starting point for discusssion, I feel more sympathy with Holden as I felt a closer, more honest, relationship with him whilst despite being let into the depths of mind during her depression, I still felt more distant as she is constantly aware that se must project an image of herself.Laura Muse
Washington, England
Sunday, January 19, 2003
Hi! I'm Caroline and I'm just staring the work of writing an essay on Sylvia Plath's feministic ideas with my starting point in "The Belljar" (I'd rather write it on her feministic views then on the mentalcare and her own personal issues with mentalcare).
I was planning to compare her with later feminists and also with today's lesbian feminism, which I think she has a bit in common with. I'd also like to discuss her ideas in comparation with today's gay-movement and queertheory-thinking. In my study, I want to know more about her effects on feministic thinking and what she has come to mean to that movement.
I was thinking I might get some tips or reactions reactions on this. If anyone has a comment to my work that might be helpful, please send it to me.
Caroline Selerud
Linkping, Sweden
Sunday, January 19, 2003
I just wanted to compliment you on a great site. I've enjoyed Plath's work but I didn't always understand it all. It's great to see the discussions with so many views. ThanksHannah
USA
Saturday, January 18, 2003
Thanks for the information on the covers of 'Wintering', they are both lovely and now I must decide which one to get. The uk cover of 'The Bell Jar' as found on amazon.co.uk is also nice.
I am also impatiently waiting Dianne Middlebrook's book called 'Hughes and Plath'. It is due out in the American Autumn (Australian Spring) through Viking press. There is some interesting information about it on her website.
Also, a question, does anyone know anything about the book about Plath called 'Suisong' by Lynne Salop published in the 70's I think. The title and the fact that I have not heard much about it does not make it sound that promising though.
Melanie Smith
Adelaide, Australia
Saturday, January 18, 2003
I am currently studying Sylvia Plaths poetry in school and find it inspiring and compelling.. but I am finding "Elms" hard to interpret.If anyone has suggestions please do leave a message on the forum.Shauna
Ireland
Wednesday, January 15, 2003
For anyone interested in seeing the beautiful cover of Wintering by Kate Moses(as previously mentioned by Amy) you can view it here
The British Amazon website has a completely different cover to the book although equally as pretty (different publisher for the UK) and you can see that here
Interestingly the North American version is listed as having 272 pages whereas the UK edition is listed as having 352 pages. I'm sure this has something to with the print being different in style or size or else one book is bigger in size then the other (taller, wider).
Stephanie
Ottawa, Canada
Thursday, January 16, 2003
To me personally Slyvia Plath was a wonderful writer. I think she deserves attention just like Emily Dickinson or Robert Frost has. She wasn't afraid to be dark she let her feelings out. To me thats all about writing poetry.Katie
St.Charles, USA
Wednesday, January 15, 2003
Following up on the current discussion of Kate Moses's WINTERING, shes not only produced a compelling narrative, imaginatively reconstructing Plaths final months in remarkable detail, but in the process managed to capture the essence of Plath's verseespecially its allusive, associative, often surreal quality. By refusing either to sentimentalize or villainize, the book has tremendous authenticity; indeed, at the risk of exposing my hopelessly retrograde sensibilities, Id describe it as literary. Abandoning strict chronology prevents the story from becoming unremittingly bleak. To be sure, the narrative relies somewhat on readers prior familiarity with Plaths biography and poetry as a kind of ur-text (hardly a problem for Forum participants!); at the same time, chapter titles promote a wonderful intertextuality--almost akin to what Susan Van Dyne demonstrates between Plaths own writings on both sides of Smith College stationery. Plath enthusiasts can look forward to WINTERING being featured in the February ELLE and MS. in March. If you live in Massachusetts, as well as the March 10th Williams College reading Lynda Bundtzen mentioned, Kate will be at Odyssey Books in South Hadley on March 7th, Borders Books in Framingham on March 11th, and the Newton Free Public Library on March 12th. New Yorkers can catch her at Barnes & Noble on March 6th. So far as I know, Hawaii is not on her current book tour!Richard Larschan
Wellesley, USA
Tuesday, January 14, 2003
Thanks for all the wonderful info about Kate Moses' "Wintering". I preordered my copy a couple of weeks ago having just read a very small review on Amazon's website (Canadian version). Its good to know that this book is nothing like Tennant's (I'm sure many others breathed a sigh of relief :).Stephanie
Ottawa, Canada
Tuesday, January 14, 2003
Peter is right about Kate Moses' WINTERING. I have been reading an advance copy she gave to me at the Symposium, and I have invited her to read at Williams on March 10. If you happen to be in the vicinity, please come. I saw Karen Kukil at the MLA convention in NYC, and she said Kate will also be giving a reading in Northampton, at a bookstore I think, but I am uncertain about the date. WINTERING is a beautifully written 'fiction' and based on a great deal of research. The chapter titles, incidentally, are the titles of the 41 poems Plath originally wanted to compose her version of ARIEL, and the title is, of course, from the final poem. This is nothing like Tennant's work.Lynda Bundtzen
Williamstown, MA 01267, USA
Monday, January 13, 2003
Peter, I have an advance review copy of Wintering, which I have just begun reading. So far, so good--and so much better than the Tennant book! The cover is unusual for a Plath book, but I think it's beautiful--a large tree full of bright red apples set against a snowy background. Not at all morbid or ghostly. Unfortunately, Amazon.com this morning lists the publication date as 12/31/69. Whoops.
For what it's worth, the upcoming issue of The Readerville Journal has a cover story on Plath's legacy (OK, I admit it--I wrote it, woo hoo!) and contains quotes from both Kate Moses and this forum's leader extraordinaire, Elaine Connell. Check the Web site for bookstore info.
Amy Rea
Eden Prairie, USA
Monday, January 13, 2003
Wintering by Kate Moses is scheduled to hit US & UK stores on or by 11 February 2003. Hmmm. She read a chapter at the Sylvia Plath Symposium at Indiana University in October/November. If I had to choose one word I'd choose gripping to describe the hold of this book, the images, the story that it tells. The book is set up with 41 chapters. Each chapter is the title of a Plath poem as she had originally ordered her Ariel collection shortly before her suicide. The chapter Kate read was the ninth, or "Stopped Dead," and it is beautifully written and spoken. It is a work of fiction but I know firsthand that the time and research put into it could make it a read as nonfiction. It is the exact opposite of Emma Tenant's unmemorable filth. It should be worthy of a very lively discussion on this forum and should get a huge amount of international.Peter K Steinberg
Boston, USA
Monday, January 13, 2003
The book "Ted and Sylvia" was written by Emma Tennant who was a former lover of Hughes (after the Plath and Assia periods of his life). Tennant would definitely know more about Hughes since she never met Plath at all. I think she was just trying to make money off their sensational story (like many others). She also wrote "Burnt Diaries" which is a memoir she wrote some years ago and in it she details her affair with TH (He was married to Carol Hughes at the time). I've never wanted to read either of those books. I'm sure the only reason she was interested in Hughes was because of his history and the thrill of having an affair with someone who is already taken. There is another book called "Wintering" by Kate Moses that is coming out in February that, from what I've read,is supposed to be really well written.Stephanie
Ottawa, Canada
Friday, January 10, 2003
Maireanne, You might take a look at my Chapters in a Mythology: The Poetry of Sylvia Plath (Harper & Row,1976), which analyzed the interrelated themes of death and rebirth in Plath's poetry.
The sections "Rituals of Death," "Rituals of Rebirth," and "Death, Rebirth, and Transcendence" might be of particular interest to you, as many of Plath's late poems are, as you have noticed, built on death/rebirth imagery--especially that which connects the death of a false self and spoiled history with the hope for (or imagery of) a rebirth, or birth of a true self.
"Rituals of Death," for example, begins: "The image of death in Sylvia Plath's late poetry usually encodes a deeper, hidden wish for rebirth, the birth of the true self. The whole thrust of "A Birthday Present" is to express the desire for an envisioned resolution of the death-in-life that is caused by falseness-whether actual falsehoods, or a paralyzing uncertainty that makes life seem tentative and unreal." An earlier title of the poem "The Truth" indicates the real nature of what the speaker wants. It is a mistake to interpret the later title as simple irony (that she should want death for her birthday)."
At the time I published my book, essentially the first full-length study of Plath, I had for years been dismayed by articles and reviews of Plath which undercut her stature by making implicit (if not explicit) connections between confessional = hysterical = suicidal = not-to-be-taken-too-seriously. This skewed readings of Plath's work, and drew attention away from what a stunningly original and powerful poet she was.
Such a correction is no longer necessary: now, 40 years after her death, her place in 20th century American poetry seems assured. But this was not the case earlier, and I wanted to correct it. It seemed important to point out (again and again) what now seems obvious. (Admittedly, there are still a few hold-outs: Harold Bloom calls her an hysterical, bad poet, but I'd bet his assessment convinces just about no one.)
All the 'confessional' poets of Plath's time (also including Sexton, Berryman, Lowell) suffered to some degree from devaluation, but Lowell and Berryman nowhere as much. Being men, they could not (whatever else one might call them) be labelled 'hysterical', and I think that makes a huge difference. That word is so across-the-board dismissive; whereas (for instance) mere madness is not.
Judith Kroll
Austin, Texas, USA
Friday, January 10, 2003
Doesn't anyone think that there are any more similarities between Plath and Sexton other than the "Confessional" label, and aside from "My Friend, My Friend" and "Daddy" (which I have read all that Stewart Clarke and Melissa Dobson have had to say about that). I don't care much for Sexton's later poetry, but surely in "Live or Die" or "The Death Notebooks" there must be some connections. I have noticed some similarities in the "psychic landscapes" of both Plath and Sexton, between "You, Dr Martin" and "Tulips", and in some of the beach imagery. However, I am particularily interested in those poems considered "suicide poems"; does anyone think that some inherent parallels - the tunnelling of narrative, harsh or futile imagery, an air of ambivalence - may be present? I think this is a very interesting study, if anyone would be willing to pursue it with me. To start off, Plath's theme of rebirth that seems to be present at the end of nearly every death-poem.... does this suggest ambivalence between the desire to live or die? Or a steadiness, an assurance that the next life will be better? Sexton's poems are without ths rebirth....or are they? "Still-born, they don't always die" - perhaps suggesting that the speaker is meant for another world, being born dead to this one. Suggestions? Comments? I am a 21 year old Psychology student with an avid interest in poetry.Maireanne
Windsor, Canada
Tuesday, January 7, 2003
A cheerful hello to all 'Plath - addicts' ! I'm a musician from Germany & beside my engagements as pianist,educator & performer I'm persuing a multimedia - project on 7 poems of Sylvia Plath for years now.Graphic design,photographs,Audio-recordings etc. accompany in-depth analyses of the following poems ( some of the most challenging,complex &mysterious ...) :
WATER - Crossing the water
WINDWARD - Parliament Hill Fields
WAYSIDE - The Rabbit Catcher
VOICELESS - Little Fugue
VEILING - Purdah
VICTIM - Mary's Song
VISION - Brasilia
A short remark to Peter Steinberg:I think Robin Peel's "Writing back" is a worthwhile reading.I like his pedantic investigations (reading the 'Observer' from day to day during 1962,trying to find out the coincidences that thrilled Plath's imagination - quotations of her book reviews for 'The New Statesman' - BBC Correspondence etc.) And you 're going to make exciting ,yet irritating discoveries: I:Bergman's film "Brink of life" (1957) & Plath's "Three Women"... Connections between Sylvia Plath's sarcastic wit & humour and Spike Milligan,The Goons,'Beyond the fringe ' - show,Stevie Smith,Punch etc.... Her close reading of the poet Laura Riding...
At last I'd like to quote one of the most beautiful passages of striking dignity: "Later in that same month of April 1962,Plath was interviewed at Court Green,for a BBC radio series featuring four Americans who had decided to settle in England...The program,called "What made you stay?"...was broadcast in September of that year, and revealed a voice quite unlike that to be heard in "Elm" or the major poems in the Ariel sequence, which Plath was soon to unleash.The recorded voice we hear, of the contented wife and mother who happens also to be a published poet,is as carefully constructed as any of Plath's other voices of maturity.The tone of modulated assurance, conveying the familiarity of residence,ownership and social position,has the hauteur of a Virginia Woolf character. Plath plays the part to the hilt.It is a striking performance. She is the " lady of the manor " in her country house,assured and almost regal. "
Birgit Schnepel
Norderstedt / Hamburg, Germany
Tuesday, January 7, 2003
Peter, I have the Lane/Stevens bibliography in our reference collection here at Hawaii State Library. For a small book (144 pgs) it looks pretty comprehensive. It lists works by Plath: published and unpublished poems and prose, interviews, letters, manuscripts, drawings published, recordings, works editted and translations, as well as works about Plath--books, articles, reviews, dissertations, poems, bibliographies. The appendices include a list of differences between the British and American editions of the 4 major colelctions, and a list of anthologies and the poems included in each. Of course, this is all 'as of 1978'.There is also "Sylvia Plath: a reference guide, 1973-1988" which is substantially a 140-pg list of critical articles, reviews and books about SP and her work, followed by a 30-pg list of newspaper articles and reviews (including all the ones about her disappearance in 1953.
Then there is "Sylvia Plath and Anne Sexton: a reference guide, which does pretty much the same thing for both SP and AS, up to 1974.
I have ordered Robin Peel's book "Writing back: Sylvia Plath and Cold War politics" for the library, but haven't seen it yet. I'll be glad to talk about it then. Actually, maybe I'd better just go out to the bookstore and see if I can pick up my own copy instead of waiting.
Jim Long
Honolulu, USA
Tuesday, January 7, 2003
Has anyone ever seen Sylvia Plath: A Bibliography by Gary Lane and Maria Stevens? The book was published in 1978 by the Scarecrow Press in Metuchen, New Jersey. It is listed as a source for Linda Wagner's Sylvia Plath: The Critical Heritage (1988) and had an entry in Stephen Tabor's SP: An Analytical Bibliography but I cannot find a copy at any university library or online.
Also, has anyone read and would anyone care to discuss anything in Writing Back by Robin Peel? Happy New Year. Cheers.Peter K Steinberg
Boston, USA
Friday, January 3, 2003
Hi, I'm a 16 year old girl who originally came form Cyprus. I have been fascinated by Sylvia Plath for about a year now. I started to get interested in it when my english teacher introduced her poetry to my class because it was to be done for our GCSEs. The first poem of hers I read was Mirror. The first time I read it I started to cry because I could feel Sylvia's pain and frustration through her amazing use of words. Since then I read as much of her poetry as I could lay my hands on. I admit that Blackberrying was one of the most comfusing poems I have ever read but after analyzing it several times I realized that it was her thoughts and perspective of life.
I have heard many things about this remarkable and beautifuly minded woman both good and bad but I have now started to use her thoughts and her life as a guide to my thoughts and aspect of life. This woman was one of the most talented people I have ever heard about and I have all the respect in the world for her.
Tyke
Watford, UK
Saturday, December 28, 2002
As regards Plath's language skills, her second language was French, not German. She did study German on her own--apparently without much success--but I don't believe she took it in school. Her understanding of French must have been faily advanced, and she likely studied it in both high school and at Smith. As part of the academic requirements at Cambridge, she translated various poems of the 16th century French poet, Pierre de Ronsard. These translations appear in the book, "Theme and Version: Plath and Ronsard," published in England. Her spoken French must have been pretty good too. One of her contempories at Cambridge is quoted as saying she spoke French without an accent. In her journals, she claims she could "get along" in French while she was in Paris, and criticizes Gordon Lamayer, whom she was traveling with, for his "stupid stammering French." Plath never disparaged her German heritage, but she aparently preferred to travel in the Latin speaking countries.Paul Snyder
New York City, USA
Sunday, December 22, 2002
Yes, Valeria, I think you're right that Plath didn't study the Greek or Latin languages as such--at least I don't recall any reference to Greek or Latin classes in her Journals or biographies of her. The language she studied was German. But the quality of her education at Smith and at Cambridge was such that she had a broad education in the classics, including the mythology (Ovid, for example) and the drama, the Greek tragedies. There are numerous references in the poetry-- for example Clytemnesta's murder of Agamemnon ("the cloak of holes"), "Electra on Azalea Path". Ted Hughes was also an influence in this direction, as mythology was always important to him. He uses the story of Orpheus and Eurydice in "The Birthday Letters" for example, and translated Seneca's "Oedipus" among other things.
It's very interesting and exciting that Plath's work is having an influence on the poetry of other languages. And there is a woman named Adriana Bottini in Italy who frequents this Forum, who is translating Plath's short stories into Italian. And I have been corresponding with a woman in Sweden who is translating the "Unabridged Journals" into Swedish. It makes me wonder what Plath would have thought if she could see how huge her influence on the world's literature might yet become.
Jim Long
Honolulu, USA
Wednesday, December 18, 2002
I feel it's a little strange to assume (although interesting) that Plath truly meant to complete her third suicide attempt just because she capitalized an N and T. I think a common opinion is that Plath's poems are all about death, suicide attempts and so on but if you pay close attention to these poems, it's obvious that Plath was often talking about rebirth (like in Lady Lazarus). This aspect of Plath's poems have been noted many times by those critiquing her work. Yes, she was depressed and she did have a history of suicide attempts but I think it is important to look deeper then just that when reading her poetry. Whether or not she meant to complete her third suicide attempt will always be up for argument. Also, the poems in question were written a good five or six months before Plath's third and final suicide attempt, which would imply that she would had to have been suicidal all during that period and not just depressed.Stephanie
Ottawa, Canada
Wednesday, December 18, 2002
Hello, I am an Italian girl, I am 18 years old and I am a student. I started reading Sylvia Plaths poems about two years ago and soon I fell in love with them. So I read immediately also her Journals and The Bell Jar all that is what has been already translated in Italy. I think that Plaths poetry is much more complex than Anne Sextons, the comprehension is not so immediate but the contents are deeper. I dont say that in order to diminish Sextons poems, which I like very much. In Italy Plath and Sexton are almost unknown, although in the last years some books about them have been published. I have started to talk about them at school, when we have time to talk about foreign poetry. I find that students are very interested about them.. young people are not used to reading poetry with pleasure, but this kind of confessional poetry (Sextons one in particular) is very different from the italian poetry we study at school, and I achieve good results. Sometimes I find some problems in explaining some Plaths methaphors and similes, because they could have more than one meaning. Often it is not clear what an object or an element in a poem symbolizes. I also chose to talk about Sexton and Plath because their poems are anyway quite simple to understand, rather than Italian contemporary poems (it could look like a contradiction but it is not). We have never had a "confessional" poetry, even if most contemporary poems are lyrical. This kind of poetry offers some wonderful images, which have never been written in any Italian poems (e.g. the methaphors which regard the body or the symbolism about spiritual life: unfortunately, an Italian poet would have never written poems such as Sheep in a Fog or Edge). I think that poems such as Ariel or Fever 104 preceded italian contemporary trends in poetry as regards the quick matching of images. Italian contemporary poetry has much to learn from her poetry written in the 60's.
A classemate of mine asked me about Plaths knowledge of classics. There is a continous presence of Greek myth in her poems, and allusions at classic culture (e.g. form Edge: Illusion of a Greek necessity) but I dont think that Sylvia knew Greek nor Latin language. I hope I did not give him a bad answer.
With pleasure (and sorry for my mistakes)
Valeria
Venice, Italy
Tuesday, December 17, 2002
I just wanted to comment on what others have written. I believe that Plath did know that her third suicide attempt would be successful. The fact that she capitalized the "n" in Number "t" in Three makes it evident. She is known for her subtle hints. I also believe that her works are beautiful. Plath lived through great personal pain. The way that she expresses her frustration and despair, though sometimes exaggerated, are easily able to be related to. She may terrify and disgust her audience but that is what makes her unique, and why she will always be remembered.Olivia
Carneys Point, USA
Friday, December 13, 2002
Hello all, I've been enoying the confessional poetry debate! Yes, Judith you are right - we don't know for sure if Hughes destroyed both journals. I should have left the word 'honestly' out of my Oct. 31 posting, simply because the gist of what I was saying really didn't need the word - my basic premise being that Hughes should not have been surprised if, after saying in print that he destroyed both journals, the public was angered and perplexed (to put it mildly). This would have been the case whether he actually destroyed one or both of the journals or not. Personally, I am not sure what to believe. If, as I suspect, at least one of the journals contained angry and unkind references to the children - as I believe it may well have (she seemed not only fearful of becoming a 'clone' of her mother, 'abandoned', with two small children, a girl and a boy to raise and sacrifice for - she seems to have particularly resented Hughes' alledgely 'gallivanting' to Spain, etc., with Assia, while she stayed home and minded two young kids while trying to work. And I don't fault her for feeling angry, for the record) - I have a hard time envisioning Hughes not destroying that journal.
Even if he were to leave it intact and unpublished until after the deaths of Frieda and Nicholas, I can't think of a good reason why he would want that kind of material 'out there' for public consumption at any time. Unless of course, he really wants Plath reputation to suffer, which is possible, but not necessarily probable.
Of course, we can only be speculative when discussing what constitutes the material of either journal. One thing that has always intrigued me is what Hughes said about 'Daddy'. He wrote that he would have held back 'Daddy' (and quite a few other poems) if the poem had not already been known/published. To feebly paraphrase him, there are quite a lot more important things than giving the world great poetry. If he was willing to supress 'Daddy', and of course the key word is suppress, not destroy, I can certainly see him supressing the journal(s). I have a hard time accepting Hughes actually destroying 'Daddy' as it is a poem. I have a less difficult time imagining him destoying her journals, because they were work books and compilations of personal thoughts, not works of art per se - at least that appears to be what Hughes thought, whatever anyone else thinks. In any case, it will be interesting to see if anything surfaces in the future, if I am not turned to dust before that time.
Finally, I second Peter's thank you - I didn't get to hear your talk at the Indiana symposium because I arrived too late, and only caught your later question and answer session, but thank you (and all participants) for atending and contributing. As a 'lay person' I relished the rare opportunity to listen to, talk to (and sometimes persistently question!) you and other writers and scholars like Linda Bundtzen, Tracey Brain, Kate Moses and Susan Van Dyne. Should another symposium be organized, I highly recommend to all Forum readers that they attend, if possible.
Kim
Detroit, USA
Wednesday, December 11, 2002
I agree with Judith Kroll that we should not "bet the farm" on Hughes having destroyed the missing journal. I tend to believe he was too conscious of literary heritage and its importance to do something so irresponsible. It would not surprise me if they have been saved somewhere for release at a future date when their contents can't harm anyone living.Elaine Connell
Hebden Bridge, UK
Wednesday, December 11, 2002
Thanks, Peter Steinberg, for your kind words about my talk presented at the Sylvia Plath Symposium in Indiana last month. No, I don't have a memoir in print about the material I used in the talk, but I am working on one.
Kim, in reference to your posting that spoke of Ted Hughes 'honestly admitting that he destroyed and lost 2 journals': we don't know that he did so, merely that he claimed he did, and it's not difficult to think of reasons why he might have been less than candid in stating that the last two journals were destroyed or lost. I wouldn't be at all surprised if at least one of these journals turned up some day; certainly wouldn't bet the farm on both those journals being gone for good.
'Confessional' was a term originally employed by M.L. Rosenthal in discussing Lowell's poetry, and alluded both to Lowell's Catholicism and to his experience of psychotherapy. That the origins of the term may lie in the Catholic confessional and the therapeutic relationship (rather than, say, in "True Confessions"--most of which probably aren't) doesn't of course negate the fact that in a broad sense the term encompasses poetry in which 'anything goes', no matter how private; but the term quickly became so bloated that any number of poets who were labelled 'confessional' might wince (and not just James Wright).
Judith Kroll
Austin, TX, USA
Monday, December 9, 2002
If Sylvia could have forged one last poem before she left us, it would have been for her children. A clutch more of something for them to grow up with; few and simple words of guidance; comforting murmurs of love; and a poignant legacy to remind them of her triumph, and not her fall.Sydney
I'm grateful for the comments of Messrs Gates, Long & Steinberg. For Jim: at your 1) no 'sonic slur' was intended. As to your question at the end of 4): I quoted Al Alvarez so, with the greatest of respect, I suggest you direct it at him, my opinion is irrelevant.
Hanover, NH, USA
Sunday, December 8, 2002
Paul Grainger
Lincoln, UK
Wednesday, December 4, 2002
On Sylvia's birthday, Oct. 27th 2002, on his NPR radio program "Writer's Almanac, Garrison Keillor read the following:
On the first day of her creative writing class at Smith College, Prof. Alfred Kazin looked over her writing sample and asked her, "If you can write like this, why the dickens do you need a creative writing class?" She replied, "I'm lonesome here, and I want to talk to you." She said, "Life is loneliness, despite all the opiates, despite the false grinning faces we all wear. And when at last you find someone to whom you feel you can pour out your soul, you stop in shock at the words you utter-- they are so rusty, so ugly, so meaningless and feeble from being kept in the small cramped dark inside you so long. Yes, there is joy, fulfill- ment and companionship--but the loneliness of the soul in its appalling self-consciousness is horrible and overpowering."
That quote is from pg. 31 of "The Unabridged Journals". It was her first winter at Smith. She was only 18 years old.
Jim Long
Honolulu, USA
Tuesday, December 3, 2002
Sydney, Plath did take up smoking in the last six months of her life. She had always been very anti-smoking and Hughes has commented here and there when he talks about this period how surprised he was to see her with a fag in hand.Kathryn Gray
London, UK
Tuesday, December 3, 2002
In an interview for "Time" magazine about Robert Lowell (reprinted in "Conversations with Elizabeth Bishop"), the interviewer mentions that "I've been trying to read some of the "confessional" poets lately. Bishop responds, "Don't you have anything better to read than that? I hate confessional poetry, and so many people are writing it these days...Besides, they seldom have anything interesting to 'confess' anyway. Mostly they write about a lot of things which I should think were best left unsaid. Dear, now you've got me a bit worried about your tastes in reading matter. Maybe I'd better send you some old copies of the "National Geographic"." So, briefly, no, I don't think you could call Bishop a confessional poet and get away with it. The same for Marianne Moore, by the way. She would be appalled to have the term applied to her, and she didn't much care for Sylvia's work either. I really dislike the tendency to class poets together with terms like "confessionalism". All poetry is self-revealing in one way or another. Plath was a lyric poet and I would hesitate to put her in a category with anyone else.Jim Long
Honolulu, USA
Tuesday, December 3, 2002
In regard to Plath as a 'confessional' poet, Judith Kroll, in CHAPTERS IN A MYTHOLOGY, wrote that "Among the current classifications in literary criticism, Plath is usually assigned the category of 'confessional' poet. That view is facilitated by the obviously autobiograpical element in her work and by the apparent accessibility of many of her best-known poems, in which the 'confessional' surface is sensational enough to divert the reader from seeing deeper meanings . . . . Nevertheless, her poetry is not primarily literal and confessional. It is, rather, the articulation of a mythic system which integrates all aspects of her work, and into which autobiographical or confessional details are shaped and absorbed, greatly qualifying how such elements ought to be viewed."
Kroll's book (an excellent analysis of what Plath was up to, in my opinion) goes on to detail Plath's 'mythic system,' including her intense concern with rebirth and transcendence. I'm not sure if the book is in print anymore. If not, it should be.
Michael Gates
Jersey City, USA
Monday, December 2, 2002
A couple of points in response to Paul's posting:1) You make it sound like I made this up myself. That's why I supported my statement with the quote from the "Princeton Encyclopedia of Poetry and Poetics". And certainly Lowell himself refers to her work as "confessional" in his Introduction to "Ariel". I was simply stating, in response to Matt's question about the confessional poets, a critical point of view that has been common currency since the '60s.
2) I'm not sure which side of the Atlantic you're refering to, since you speak in terms of "UK academics, poets, or other 'interested parties'" but are apparently writing from the US, but the fact that a point of view is "fashionable" doesn't make it authoritative
or objective.It's difficult to see how Alvarez can describe Plath's work as "private" and "volatile" and "angry" and "unforgiving" and yet also "detached". It seems to me that these 4 adjectives preclude any real detachment. It is true that, in some of her last poems, Plath affected an impersonal point of view, speaking of herself in the 3rd person, as in "the woman is perfected" etc. But this is a pose, a way of distancing herself, that doesn't necessarily involve a true emotional detachment. In fact it might be seen as a defense against a real emotional involvement. And it doesn't make the poem any less self-revealing.
3) If it is true that "Alvarez knew SP as well as anyone other than her family and her husband" (and I don't necessarily agree that this is true, in fact I think it's nonsense. If he knew her so well he should have known how vulnerable she was.), than isn't it possible that Alvarez is not necessarily the most objective judge of either her work or her mental status? He has famously exhibited his own sense of guilt about his rejection of her in her final depression. This way of seeing her as "detached" seems to me a way of protecting himself from the implications of her emotional response to his turning her away.
4) As far as confessionalism being a "mindless, loose-lipped style": confessionalism is not a "style". It is a mode of expression of which there are many "styles". In a manner of speaking, each poet has his or her own style. Lowell's style was not Plath's, nor Sexton's nor Berryman's. I would be interested to hear who you think wrote in this "mindless, loose-lipped style".
Jim Long
Honolulu, USA
Monday, December 2, 2002
I know this is probably an extremely dumb question, but did Sylvia Plath smoke? There are a few references to her smoking, such as in Ryan Adams' song, but I don't ever recall reading anything specific in her journals or in biographies about her smoking. Someone please clarify this for me!Sydney
Hanover, NH, USA
Monday, December 2, 2002
